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constitution and not to grover norquist. what did grover norquist do? he took their quotes, called them up, he had conversations with them and he read them line by line their quote and essentially threatened them with primaries. he's the problem. if grover norquist wants to run government he needs to run office. >> you have people like saxby chambliss to indicate they were backing away from their pledge. grover norquist gets on the phone to them in the last several days and report of phone calls are that suddenly chambliss is going back a little bit maybe on what he had to say. so, i mean, do you think that his influence has waned? >> this is exactly what i'm saying is that, and chambliss is who i was thinking about. he threatens people. i do think his influence is reining. i think there's a crack in grover's armor and that's why he tried to shore it up last week by calling up people and intimidating them. it's time we hold him to task. he should not be allowed to hold the republican party hostage like he has. it's very irresponsible. do i think there's
constitution and not to grover norquist. what did grover norquist do? he took their quotes, called them up, he had conversations with them and he read them line by line their quote and essentially threatened them with primaries. he's the problem. if grover norquist wants to run government he needs to run office. >> you have people like saxby chambliss to indicate they were backing away from their pledge. grover norquist gets on the phone to them in the last several days and report of...
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but grover norquist is smart on this. even if it's more efficient, that makes it easier to raise taxes. a tax code that gets high enough it's hurting the country because they won't allow real tax reform to support it. >> i totally agree. you end up in a situation where we on the books have a progressive system. even compared to other countries. we pay much less in taxes overall and we have much stingier-defined public goods. the point is that the most successful social welfare states are one where there's this universal pay in. the way we're going with this inequality is talking about means testing, which is a way from a model of universal pay in and benefit. that's sustainable. >> chris hayes, thank you for being here. >>> oneover the coolest things human beings has ever seen celebrates a big birthday. it's sort of a best new moment of geek and it's coming up. >>> still ahead, the amazing story behind this incredible photo. if you look closely, that's me just to the north of mexico. wait. that's not right. >>> in 1997 th
but grover norquist is smart on this. even if it's more efficient, that makes it easier to raise taxes. a tax code that gets high enough it's hurting the country because they won't allow real tax reform to support it. >> i totally agree. you end up in a situation where we on the books have a progressive system. even compared to other countries. we pay much less in taxes overall and we have much stingier-defined public goods. the point is that the most successful social welfare states are...
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but grover norquist is smart on this. even if it's more efficient, that makes it easier to raise taxes. i worry the compromise here is a tax code that gets high enough it's hurting the country because republicans one allow creation of real tax reform that would support it. >> the other problem. i totally agree. the other problem, you end up in a situation where we on the books have a progressive system. even compared to other countries. we pay much less in taxes overall, and we have much stingier-defined public goods. that we provision through the state. the point is that the most successful social welfare states are one where there's this universal pay-in and universal benefit. the way we're going with this inequality is talking about means testing and redistribution, which is away from a model of universal pay-in and universal benefit, that is the thing that is long-term sustainable. >> chris hayes, thank you for being here. host of "up with chris hayes." >>> one of the coolest things human beings has ever seen celebrat
but grover norquist is smart on this. even if it's more efficient, that makes it easier to raise taxes. i worry the compromise here is a tax code that gets high enough it's hurting the country because republicans one allow creation of real tax reform that would support it. >> the other problem. i totally agree. the other problem, you end up in a situation where we on the books have a progressive system. even compared to other countries. we pay much less in taxes overall, and we have much...
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think of grover norquist and the influence he has. i don't like grover norquist. i don't like jim demint, but that's what i think he's thinking. >> john, i want to go to the house of representatives. it looks like some real purging going on over there. we have a number of right wing members of the house who have been knocked off their committees. speaker boehner is exerting control. look at four republican members who were recently kicked off their committees, justin amash, huelskamp, david schweikert, and walter jones were booted from the house financial services committee. all four of these men have a history of voting against boehner and the house republican leadership. it looks like they have one thing in common, he's too right for boehner. >> i think the real problem for boehner is he's playing a risky game in the sense that people are starting to whisper that in these negotiations he actually is not being tough enough, that he should be out there saying that this president is addicted to spending. he needs an intervention, and this is the fight right now. in
think of grover norquist and the influence he has. i don't like grover norquist. i don't like jim demint, but that's what i think he's thinking. >> john, i want to go to the house of representatives. it looks like some real purging going on over there. we have a number of right wing members of the house who have been knocked off their committees. speaker boehner is exerting control. look at four republican members who were recently kicked off their committees, justin amash, huelskamp,...
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norquist, et cetera. >> let's get to grover norquist in a minute, but i do have a question. the gop plan consists of $2.2 trillion in savings over a decade. that includes raging the eligibility age for medicare from 65 to 67. and lowering cost of living increases for social security benefits. they also propose overhauling the tax code to generate $800 billion in new revenue. but without raising taxes on the wealthy. in a letter to the president, leading republicans compared their plan to one erskine bowles drew up last year. >> not even close. >> he rejected that connection and the white house, of course, is hitting the road. we'll get to that in a moment. but here's my question. i've been watching the coverage of this and reading it. and there's a lot of liberals who were like, he won, ha, ha, they're so arrogant about it, it's hard to like them. because it's just not attractive. but he did -- >> yeah, he won. >> and he is going to the american people with this. and why can't the starting point of these negotiations be about the tax rates and go from there. why are we at sq
norquist, et cetera. >> let's get to grover norquist in a minute, but i do have a question. the gop plan consists of $2.2 trillion in savings over a decade. that includes raging the eligibility age for medicare from 65 to 67. and lowering cost of living increases for social security benefits. they also propose overhauling the tax code to generate $800 billion in new revenue. but without raising taxes on the wealthy. in a letter to the president, leading republicans compared their plan to...
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. >> you mentioned grover norquist. he's making a new prediction, by the way. let's listen. >> understand how ugly the next four years are going to get. everything in obamacare that obama didn't want you to focus on or think about, the 90% of his trillion-dollar tax increase was pushed over till after he got himself safely re-elected. all those regulations you're now hearing about, okay, those all hit after the election. we've got four bad years of regulation taxes. he wants to add higher taxes to that. tea party 2 is going to dwarf tea party 1 if obama pushes us off the cliff. >> so basically, jon, what grover norquist is saying there to members of the tea party set who have been elected, who were elected, is, you know, we're going to take everybody who is against us into a primary on your right. >> right. >> on the republican side. >> right. >> so the threat has been issued already, even before we begin negotiating what the package will be. >> oh, yeah. >> this is like political terrorism. >> well, it's certainly a clear bargaining position. i remember three
. >> you mentioned grover norquist. he's making a new prediction, by the way. let's listen. >> understand how ugly the next four years are going to get. everything in obamacare that obama didn't want you to focus on or think about, the 90% of his trillion-dollar tax increase was pushed over till after he got himself safely re-elected. all those regulations you're now hearing about, okay, those all hit after the election. we've got four bad years of regulation taxes. he wants to add...
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norquist. >> they will have to go home and explain to their constituents, many middle class people why they didn't defend them, why they basically put protecting the 2% over protecting the middle class. that is not a position you want to be in at christmas time. >> luke, the democrats will have to give up something, are they not? we know look, the republicans don't have a lot of leverage here, but if they're going to take the debt ceiling off the table, there's got to be something given on medicare and social security? >> if there is to be a big deal, then one would suspect yeah, they would have to. i think there is a group of folks on both sides that realize this is a significant moment where you could actually do something big if you wanted. but the issue seems here, alex, as long as there's no movement on the 250, what really can you do? i'll throw something out there and i think it's interesting you mention tom coburn. because you're starting to see somewhat of a divide between elder senate republicans who have been in d.c., understand how the parlor games operate, as opposed to th
norquist. >> they will have to go home and explain to their constituents, many middle class people why they didn't defend them, why they basically put protecting the 2% over protecting the middle class. that is not a position you want to be in at christmas time. >> luke, the democrats will have to give up something, are they not? we know look, the republicans don't have a lot of leverage here, but if they're going to take the debt ceiling off the table, there's got to be something...
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grover norquist also an outsider, as you mentioned. clearly that works. the other piece about scott that i think is so interesting, even though as you pointed out, he is not on my cell we are not texting, we are not calling. >> but i would be the first to get up and give credit to a republican party that thought more about how to include minority voices in leadership. it's something they have struggled with. they should do it. and policy is important too there is a whole question around civil rights. i would argue way behind. but representation matters. jay-z famously said on his most recent album, when you see me, see you. politics works the same way. you want success to be shared. you want it to be represented. and i would urge the republicans to think long and hard about how to have a leadership structure that looks more like america. >> you just dropped the mic. i love it. i love it. more from the brain trust on the other side of this break as the supreme court is about to take up same-sex marriage. it is being called a watershed moment in the fight f
grover norquist also an outsider, as you mentioned. clearly that works. the other piece about scott that i think is so interesting, even though as you pointed out, he is not on my cell we are not texting, we are not calling. >> but i would be the first to get up and give credit to a republican party that thought more about how to include minority voices in leadership. it's something they have struggled with. they should do it. and policy is important too there is a whole question around...
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bob corker, the republican in the senate said he would break the grover norquist push. he didn't talk about the tax rates. as we all know, the key is the president's and democrats insistence on the rate going up from 35 to 39n't 6%. this week, he was much more specific. he's saying to republicans, hey, cut our losses now and live to fight another day. here he is. >> has a growing group of folks looking at this and realizing we don't have a lot of cards as it relates to the tax issue. we have one house, that's it. the presidency and the senate in the democrats hands. a lot of people are putting forth a theory. i think it has merit. you go in and give the president the 2% increase that he's talking about. the rate increase on the top 2%. all of a sudden, the shift goes back to entitlements. >> what corker is also saying, what he went on to say is when we hit the debt ceiling next year, in february, then republicans are going to have the leverage then. that's something the president dispu disputed. one problem, bob corker is a senator, he's not in the house of representati
bob corker, the republican in the senate said he would break the grover norquist push. he didn't talk about the tax rates. as we all know, the key is the president's and democrats insistence on the rate going up from 35 to 39n't 6%. this week, he was much more specific. he's saying to republicans, hey, cut our losses now and live to fight another day. here he is. >> has a growing group of folks looking at this and realizing we don't have a lot of cards as it relates to the tax issue. we...
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. >> bob, you, yesterday, shadowed grover norquist for quite some time. you went to the meeting, his wednesday meeting. >> that's right. >> he has all the time with some of the most powerful conservatives in d.c. and across the country attending. what was their attitude about any deal that boehner might have to make? >> it's pretty interesting when you talk to house republicans because they look at boehner from two different perspectives. on one side, boehner went in front of the house conference and he said, i'm not going to back any deal that increases rates. so they feel pretty confident on rates. that's where i think "the new york times" comes from. on rates they think boehner is still with house conservatives. at the same time, there's a lot of raised eyebrows right now because just as boehner is promising not to buckle on rates, he's purging four conservatives from committee. >> i was going to ask you about that. now, newt, and bob livingston tried that with mark newman back in '95. that didn't work out well for him. we said we're going to vote agai
. >> bob, you, yesterday, shadowed grover norquist for quite some time. you went to the meeting, his wednesday meeting. >> that's right. >> he has all the time with some of the most powerful conservatives in d.c. and across the country attending. what was their attitude about any deal that boehner might have to make? >> it's pretty interesting when you talk to house republicans because they look at boehner from two different perspectives. on one side, boehner went in...